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	<title>Comments on: Manager&#8217;s generosity backfires &#8212; lands company in court</title>
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	<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/</link>
	<description>Up-to-the-minute cases and law impacting HR</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:01:31 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: YV</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5563</link>
		<dc:creator>YV</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 18:42:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5563</guid>
		<description>Does anyone know if a company policy requires employees to utilize all types of paid leave (PTO, sick, vacation) prior to taking any unpaid leave while on an approved leave (FMLA) and the employee is recieving 60% of their weekly wage from a STD plan can the employer require the employee to use 40% equivalent of thier paid leave balance to bring them up to 100%?  In other words, if an employee is refusing to use paid leave because they are receiv a STD payment of 60% of their weekly wage is a company prohibited from expecting employees to use paid leave for the difference altogether under the new FMLA regs?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does anyone know if a company policy requires employees to utilize all types of paid leave (PTO, sick, vacation) prior to taking any unpaid leave while on an approved leave (FMLA) and the employee is recieving 60% of their weekly wage from a STD plan can the employer require the employee to use 40% equivalent of thier paid leave balance to bring them up to 100%?  In other words, if an employee is refusing to use paid leave because they are receiv a STD payment of 60% of their weekly wage is a company prohibited from expecting employees to use paid leave for the difference altogether under the new FMLA regs?</p>
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		<title>By: RJB</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5556</link>
		<dc:creator>RJB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 15:09:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5556</guid>
		<description>DJC - yes we have a union contract which protects seniortiy only not specific jobs for up to 18 months.  We would most likely protect the jobs as well with a small organization (15 employees) like ours but I believe the original article was about a company that thought they would protect job also.  We are a local Municipal Authority.  I recenlty had somonee on STD and never really gave much thought to FMLA running concurrent.  I will do a little more research on this issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DJC &#8211; yes we have a union contract which protects seniortiy only not specific jobs for up to 18 months.  We would most likely protect the jobs as well with a small organization (15 employees) like ours but I believe the original article was about a company that thought they would protect job also.  We are a local Municipal Authority.  I recenlty had somonee on STD and never really gave much thought to FMLA running concurrent.  I will do a little more research on this issue.</p>
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		<title>By: DjC</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5534</link>
		<dc:creator>DjC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 22:18:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5534</guid>
		<description>RJB - If you are government, is there a union contract, and is leave addressed within the contract?  You may be required to grant protected leave time, per the contract, beyond what is protected by FMLA.  Do you have state leave laws and if so how do they compare with FMLA?  What is the size of your employee base and can they be counted as part of a larger group?  What level/branch of government?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RJB &#8211; If you are government, is there a union contract, and is leave addressed within the contract?  You may be required to grant protected leave time, per the contract, beyond what is protected by FMLA.  Do you have state leave laws and if so how do they compare with FMLA?  What is the size of your employee base and can they be counted as part of a larger group?  What level/branch of government?</p>
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		<title>By: RJB</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5526</link>
		<dc:creator>RJB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:21:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5526</guid>
		<description>DJC - thanks for answer.  One of your comments brought me to another thought.  After STD expires we also offer long term disabiltiy which of course would last longer than the 12 weeks under FMLA.  I assume from you comments that if leave extends past the 12 weeks the employees job may not be protected (at least under FMLA).  This is sometimes very difficult since we are such a small employer but FMLA includes governement no matter what size.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DJC &#8211; thanks for answer.  One of your comments brought me to another thought.  After STD expires we also offer long term disabiltiy which of course would last longer than the 12 weeks under FMLA.  I assume from you comments that if leave extends past the 12 weeks the employees job may not be protected (at least under FMLA).  This is sometimes very difficult since we are such a small employer but FMLA includes governement no matter what size.</p>
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		<title>By: DjC</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5522</link>
		<dc:creator>DjC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:23:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5522</guid>
		<description>Thanks HH

to RJB - STD is an &quot;insurance&quot;, to pay for time off.  FMLA is a leave designation.  As indicated by Mary, they can and should go hand in hand (run concurrent) if the reason for STD meets FMLA leave criteria (i.e. &quot;Employee&#039;s own serious health condition, including pregnancy related conditions&quot;).  FMLA was in-acted to protect the employee from job loss and disciplinary issues surrounding the absence.   

The other side of FMLA is protection for the employer.  FMLA restricts the amount of &quot;protected&quot; time off an employee can take for specifically designated reasons.  Prior to recent changes, if your policies required the use of paid time (i.e.; vac, sick leave and PTO), and they should, concurrent with the FMLA, then your total loss of that employee in any one 12 month period  was 12 weeks.  That has now changed with the new military leave categories and in certain circumstances an employee may get more than 12 weeks.  

As an employer in Oregon, a VERY employee friendly state, our state leave laws are much broader and by law we have to follow whichever is more beneficial to the employee.  Quite often the two leaves (FMLA and OFLA) can run concurrent.  However, there are different leave types that are protected by one and not the other resulting in expanding the amount of time any one employee can be away from their job while  maintaining their protected status. In addition it makes the whole designation/tracking process that much more confusing.  

I find the whole federal and state leave process confusing at best.  And don&#039;t even get me started on &quot;intermittent leave&quot; (lol).  The best advice I can give is to verify each leave type (state/federal) seperately, then and only then look at them together.  This way helps ensure that you are meeting the criteria of both leaves and not running afoul of one or the other.  And be sure not to get protected leave confused with other items (STD &amp; LTD insurance).  

djc</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks HH</p>
<p>to RJB &#8211; STD is an &#8220;insurance&#8221;, to pay for time off.  FMLA is a leave designation.  As indicated by Mary, they can and should go hand in hand (run concurrent) if the reason for STD meets FMLA leave criteria (i.e. &#8220;Employee&#8217;s own serious health condition, including pregnancy related conditions&#8221;).  FMLA was in-acted to protect the employee from job loss and disciplinary issues surrounding the absence.   </p>
<p>The other side of FMLA is protection for the employer.  FMLA restricts the amount of &#8220;protected&#8221; time off an employee can take for specifically designated reasons.  Prior to recent changes, if your policies required the use of paid time (i.e.; vac, sick leave and PTO), and they should, concurrent with the FMLA, then your total loss of that employee in any one 12 month period  was 12 weeks.  That has now changed with the new military leave categories and in certain circumstances an employee may get more than 12 weeks.  </p>
<p>As an employer in Oregon, a VERY employee friendly state, our state leave laws are much broader and by law we have to follow whichever is more beneficial to the employee.  Quite often the two leaves (FMLA and OFLA) can run concurrent.  However, there are different leave types that are protected by one and not the other resulting in expanding the amount of time any one employee can be away from their job while  maintaining their protected status. In addition it makes the whole designation/tracking process that much more confusing.  </p>
<p>I find the whole federal and state leave process confusing at best.  And don&#8217;t even get me started on &#8220;intermittent leave&#8221; (lol).  The best advice I can give is to verify each leave type (state/federal) seperately, then and only then look at them together.  This way helps ensure that you are meeting the criteria of both leaves and not running afoul of one or the other.  And be sure not to get protected leave confused with other items (STD &amp; LTD insurance).  </p>
<p>djc</p>
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		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5520</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 15:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5520</guid>
		<description>To RJB:

FMLA should run concurrent to STD. You need to make sure you offer it and do the appropriate paperwork.  It doesn&#039;t hurt to do it, even if you are sure the employee&#039;s job is completely safe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To RJB:</p>
<p>FMLA should run concurrent to STD. You need to make sure you offer it and do the appropriate paperwork.  It doesn&#8217;t hurt to do it, even if you are sure the employee&#8217;s job is completely safe.</p>
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		<title>By: Yankee Kid</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5519</link>
		<dc:creator>Yankee Kid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 15:40:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5519</guid>
		<description>To All:  I appreciate the conversation here and the insights that have been provided.  In response to some of the questions posed in this circumstance, you have raised some very good points.  We did something for a young kid that had a very shaky situation, both personally, financially and then with his health that we looked at once we started into it and wondered if we just opened pandoras box.  Mary and Babbs, you are correct...that is why I started this conversation...unsure that we did the right thing and looking for other thoughts that could change the way we do things in the future.  We were again trying to the right thing by a good employee and now are wondering if it will backfire!  Certainly hope not, but in this day and age, you never know!  Thanks again to all for the insights!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To All:  I appreciate the conversation here and the insights that have been provided.  In response to some of the questions posed in this circumstance, you have raised some very good points.  We did something for a young kid that had a very shaky situation, both personally, financially and then with his health that we looked at once we started into it and wondered if we just opened pandoras box.  Mary and Babbs, you are correct&#8230;that is why I started this conversation&#8230;unsure that we did the right thing and looking for other thoughts that could change the way we do things in the future.  We were again trying to the right thing by a good employee and now are wondering if it will backfire!  Certainly hope not, but in this day and age, you never know!  Thanks again to all for the insights!</p>
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		<title>By: RJB</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5517</link>
		<dc:creator>RJB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 15:26:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5517</guid>
		<description>I have a quesiton.  We offer Short Term Disabiltiy for the employees.  What if an employee is off on STD and comes back and there job is not available?  Does FMLA run concurrent witj STD?  Also we are only 15 employees but considered local government which I believe means FMLA applies to our company.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have a quesiton.  We offer Short Term Disabiltiy for the employees.  What if an employee is off on STD and comes back and there job is not available?  Does FMLA run concurrent witj STD?  Also we are only 15 employees but considered local government which I believe means FMLA applies to our company.</p>
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		<title>By: HH</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5512</link>
		<dc:creator>HH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 14:11:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5512</guid>
		<description>I agree with DJC.  Stop sharing your political beliefs/comments and stick to the HR topic</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with DJC.  Stop sharing your political beliefs/comments and stick to the HR topic</p>
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		<title>By: DjC</title>
		<link>http://www.hrlegalnews.com/managers-generosity-backfires-lands-company-in-court/comment-page-1/#comment-5492</link>
		<dc:creator>DjC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:32:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrlegalnews.com/?p=1107#comment-5492</guid>
		<description>This is being submitted more for the publishers of this website than for those of you who post here.

Sad.....

...unfortunately I think many people who respond here forget what the purpose of this website is...at least what I thought it was for.  I thought it was to train and educate employers and HR reps on labor law and personnel issues.  While we may not like some of the laws, they are the law and to avoid lawsuits, we need to know how to operate within the law.  

I did not think this was meant to be a forum to discuss the pros and cons of today&#039;s politics. I came here to learn, not to be preached to.  Problem is though.....

1) Most of the time we are presented with an inflamed snap shot of the situation - note - &quot;Manager&#039;s Generosity Backfires - lands company in court!&quot;     Could this be intentional?

2) As a result it sets many people off, on assumptions, accusations and eventually political diatribe.  After a while it all gets so tiring.

I guess this isn&#039;t the site for me and it is time to cancel my subscription.  Too bad....I really hoped I had found a place that could help me and teach me.  A place where I could rely on others experience and professionalism.  Apparently anger and accusations tend to be more the norm here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is being submitted more for the publishers of this website than for those of you who post here.</p>
<p>Sad&#8230;..</p>
<p>&#8230;unfortunately I think many people who respond here forget what the purpose of this website is&#8230;at least what I thought it was for.  I thought it was to train and educate employers and HR reps on labor law and personnel issues.  While we may not like some of the laws, they are the law and to avoid lawsuits, we need to know how to operate within the law.  </p>
<p>I did not think this was meant to be a forum to discuss the pros and cons of today&#8217;s politics. I came here to learn, not to be preached to.  Problem is though&#8230;..</p>
<p>1) Most of the time we are presented with an inflamed snap shot of the situation &#8211; note &#8211; &#8220;Manager&#8217;s Generosity Backfires &#8211; lands company in court!&#8221;     Could this be intentional?</p>
<p>2) As a result it sets many people off, on assumptions, accusations and eventually political diatribe.  After a while it all gets so tiring.</p>
<p>I guess this isn&#8217;t the site for me and it is time to cancel my subscription.  Too bad&#8230;.I really hoped I had found a place that could help me and teach me.  A place where I could rely on others experience and professionalism.  Apparently anger and accusations tend to be more the norm here.</p>
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